Flipper, you said: " Especially on the point late in the article where it says essentially what if the elders aren't in harmony or carrying out what the governing body says? Does that give reason for some to show insubordination to the elders? The article said witnesses should still obey and the biggest catch phrase on earth, ( leave it in Jehovah's hands and in time he will take care of it, show respect for Him and still obey.) I told the elders this was ridiculous counsel, and that God wants us to use our free will and conscience to make decisions. If the elders told you to jump off a cliff would you, I asked? Then I thought privately to myself, " God I hope these brainwashed elders do jump off a cliff" how evil of me!!!!"........................................................................... Very nice argument there, it put a laugh on my face. I too discuss it with some witness in the KH after the wt study. I argued that if a witness knew that a certain direction of an elder is wrong and is against the society's policy or against a biblical principle, and yet he willfully still follow the elders direction, that shows a blatant disregard to Jehovah. That makes him wicked because he knew it was wrong and still willfully yield to the elders' wish. The witness i was talking with was speechless for a while thinking and then he said the the society might not held you accountable because you were just following instruction. i refute back that Jehovah punished not only corah and his elders but also those who were following him. he was speechless again.
dark angle
JoinedPosts by dark angle
-
64
Our Watchtower Study On obedience & submission
by dark angle inyesterday we have a study of the watchtower about obedience and submission.
this study arose a lot of questions and heightened emotions in me and the interested retired judge sitting besides me.
we came accross the 9th pharagraph, page 28 of the april 1, 2007, where it says that: "it is easy to obey when everything is clear and we agree, but we will show that we are trully submissive if we yeild even when we do not personally understand the direction provided.
-
-
-
63
Predestination?
by Zico inpredestination is something ive been thinking a bit about of late, mainly due to a wt article on the subject printed in the may awake, which i read after skimming through the magazine at the weekend.
i believe the wt reasoning on the subject is that god has the ability to see into the future, but that he chooses not to look into the future, as it would negate our free will, although the recent may article was more a criticism of predestination, and although they didnt assert their own position, what struck me from reading the article, and contemplating the wt article in general is that they seem to focus on time a lot, and its this part where the wt idea of predestination seems to fall down to me.
if god created the universe and everything in it, as a jw would assert, this would also mean he would have had to have created time (which is a product of our universe) and so before god created time, it, obviously, wouldnt have existed, and without time, there cant be a past, present and future.
-
-
dark angle
helo zicko, God must be playing Timeshift. This will give you an idea of what might he be doing. watch the sort movie here. http://timeshiftgame.com/us/ enjoy!!!
-
64
Our Watchtower Study On obedience & submission
by dark angle inyesterday we have a study of the watchtower about obedience and submission.
this study arose a lot of questions and heightened emotions in me and the interested retired judge sitting besides me.
we came accross the 9th pharagraph, page 28 of the april 1, 2007, where it says that: "it is easy to obey when everything is clear and we agree, but we will show that we are trully submissive if we yeild even when we do not personally understand the direction provided.
-
-
dark angle
"They don't realize that the organization cannot be any stronger or better than its members. "........................................................Very true!! Thanks WTWizard for pointing that out!! any organization is made up basically with people. and with the procedure the are now practicing about submission, it seems all they would have eventually are people without original thoughts, suppressed emotion, and dull thinkers which could hardly contribute fresh new ideas to the org.
-
64
Our Watchtower Study On obedience & submission
by dark angle inyesterday we have a study of the watchtower about obedience and submission.
this study arose a lot of questions and heightened emotions in me and the interested retired judge sitting besides me.
we came accross the 9th pharagraph, page 28 of the april 1, 2007, where it says that: "it is easy to obey when everything is clear and we agree, but we will show that we are trully submissive if we yeild even when we do not personally understand the direction provided.
-
-
dark angle
I felt that this kind of reason goes against anyones right to freedom and liberty. anyone should have the right to know the reasons for beliefs and policies.almost all educated, intelligent, free persons demand to know the reason behind policies and to assess it whether is it true or not, practical or not, reasonable or unreasonable. Jesus himself said that the truth shall make us free, not slaves!!! i hate you members of the governing body as you try to exploit and manipulate the word of God for you own power-trip agenda. May God bring upon you whats deserving for you.
-
64
Our Watchtower Study On obedience & submission
by dark angle inyesterday we have a study of the watchtower about obedience and submission.
this study arose a lot of questions and heightened emotions in me and the interested retired judge sitting besides me.
we came accross the 9th pharagraph, page 28 of the april 1, 2007, where it says that: "it is easy to obey when everything is clear and we agree, but we will show that we are trully submissive if we yeild even when we do not personally understand the direction provided.
-
-
dark angle
Yesterday we have a study of the watchtower about obedience and submission. this study arose a lot of questions and heightened emotions in me and the interested retired Judge sitting besides me. we came accross the 9th pharagraph, page 28 of the april 1, 2007, where it says that: "It is easy to obey when everything is clear and we agree, but we will show that we are trully submissive if we yeild even when we do not personally understand the direction provided. peter, who later became an apostle, showed this kind of submission.-luke 5:4,5" i told him that this kind of arrangement is a little bit dangerous as it demands unquestionable obedience and could be manipulated by power-hungry individuals. He said back to me that this system of arrangement is like Hitlers'. I was shocked by his response!! what might be your comments about this topic?
-
29
What do we really know about Jehovah?
by PopeOfEruke ini started making a list of what we really know about jehovah from the bible.
see if you can add to the list.. 1. likes to take afternoon walks, especially when it's breezy.. 2. likes the smell of roasting animals.. 3. likes dancing and singing but doesn't necessarily dance and sing himself.. 4. can write a little bit, though only with one finger.
usually gets humans to write for him instead.. 5. seems to like cheap magic tricks, like talking donkeys and magic burning bushes.. 6. always resorts to violence to solve problems instead of dialogue or diplomacy.. 7. he can reproduce asexually.. 8. he likes to be called father and he has sons, but his "wife" is a group of sexless spirits, who are also his sons.. any more??.
-
-
dark angle
25. He always wants to be praised!!! if not, you'll face his wrath. (great selfsteem!!)
-
8
Examples of false reasoning to support Watchtower doctrine- logical fallacy
by jwfacts inbelow is a discussion of methods of rhetorical fallacy with examples where the watcthower has used these techniques to support suspect doctrine.
can you think of any other examples?.
fallacy number 4 - either/or reasoning.
-
-
dark angle
Thanks for such work!! how easily it is to spot fallacious tactics the WTBS use now. FALSE TEACHERS!!!
-
5
Knocking My Impresssions
by kwr ini just watched the knocking dvd and it is a very good documentary about jw's.
two families are followed by the producer.
one is 23 year old seth that is dying from liver failure and requires a transplant.
-
-
dark angle
how to obtain it? little bit curious of the end story.
-
26
Chance that WT drops blood issue?
by Gayle indo you think wt will drop blood tranfusion issue altogether?
will it, say within ten years?
any predictions?
-
-
dark angle
i think they will!! tweaking and mutating our beliefs has been our trademark. our belief is evolving very rapidly now.In around 10yrs or more they will declare it as a new light and will make a global celebration out of it. After all jehovah made the mosquito and several creatures to drink blood!!! A new book or brochure will be released on a district convention and all weak minded will be applauding it. and they will say "thanks to god for revealing the sacred secret to the mosquitos and to us".
-
39
New Light on Lions Eating Straw ! ? !
by Open mind innewbie poster here looking for advice.
i've been looking for posts on the borg moving away from a literal understanding of isaiah 65:25 and couldn't find any.
i posted in the private support members only area with a much longer post and it's been pretty much ignored.
-
-
dark angle
This teaching is full gigantic holes, a haw-Shaw. not only it upsets our planets ecological balance but it show that God was all right wrong in creating the earth since predatory activities of living creatures existed millions of years before Adam & eve sinned!!!! If the WTBS is correct, then God was mistaken for millions of years in designing our world.